Liberty 11 at #5 BG 56 Final (aka The Reason BG Does NOT Deserve a MNC this season)

[misterfootball]

Opinion Polls. Computer Polls. The Opinion Polls can certainly be biased. The Computer algorithms are skewed (ie: Mater Dei staying #1 in Massey AFTER getting beat 28-0). So, the @misterfootball National High School Top 50 Composite Rankings sorts all this out.

🙂

 

[GardenStateBaller]

2 hours ago, JCGIII said:

So, the Bishop bailed on the Monarchs? If that's the case, shame on them. 

Yes, BG unexpectedly canceled the return game of their home and home series with MD in order to play LBP in Oregon at Nike headquarters. 

[GardenStateBaller]

6 hours ago, Omaha Vol said:

That's the issue a lot of people have with your poll. SOS is very important, but it is NOT the tell all for every team. 

The N in MNC stands for National. Can't play an entirely in-state schedule and expect to be a "National" champ. Look at the last 5-7 years of Champs. They all have at least one oos win to their credit. Hence, the modern era of HSFB. 

[GardenStateBaller]

6 hours ago, Omaha Vol said:

That's the issue a lot of people have with your poll. SOS is very important, but it is NOT the tell all for every team. 

Do you agree with MD being #1 this morning in two national polls? Each pollster has its own set of criteria. SOS is #3 in our list of criteria behind 1. being undefeated and 2. having at least one elite oos win. 

[misterfootball]

20 hours ago, GardenStateBaller said:

  ...We're using the exact same criteria that enabled MC to win their MNC last season. 

 

I I shortened your response so my reply wouldn't be so long) ...

2022 St. Frances Academy was one of the best Teams to NOT win a National title. They lost to IMG, but beat FOUR State Champions and TWO State Runner-ups - 

East St. Louis (IL) - Illinois 6A Champions
DeSoto (TX) - Texas 6A-II Champions
Dutch Fork (SC) - South Carolina 5A Champions
Kahuku (HI) - Hawaii I-Open Champions
Venice (FL) - Florida 4S Runner-up
Arundel (MD) - Maryland 4A/3A Runner-up

That one loss kept them from the NationalHSFB,com National Title and possibly #1 from another Poll or two.

 

Miami Central was certainly deserving, but that St. Frances schedule - WOW.

Edited November 24, 2023 by misterfootball
forgot some stuff

[CaliFB]

I think GSB is holding that cancelled game between MD and BG over their head. You don't know the circumstances why the cancelled. Because from my understanding they are traveling to Cali to play this next year. Does it matter this year no but having seen MD, Bosco and BG live I think BG is the best of the 3 and yes that's my opinion. Usually when you have a comparison between 2 or more teams that didn't play you look to see if they have a common opponent. In this case they all do and it's Corona Centennial. The most dominant of those 3 was BG. 

[GardenStateBaller]

2 hours ago, CaliFB said:

I think GSB is holding that cancelled game between MD and BG over their head. You don't know the circumstances why the cancelled. Because from my understanding they are traveling to Cali to play this next year. Does it matter this year no but having seen MD, Bosco and BG live I think BG is the best of the 3 and yes that's my opinion. Usually when you have a comparison between 2 or more teams that didn't play you look to see if they have a common opponent. In this case they all do and it's Corona Centennial. The most dominant of those 3 was BG. 

IMG has the best win of the two teams. They beat #6 SJP, while BG beat #10 Cen10, who has three losses. Beating all publics will never be the formula for success when it comes to a power private’s desire to win a MNC. 

[Omaha Vol]

7 hours ago, GardenStateBaller said:

Do you agree with MD being #1 this morning in two national polls? Each pollster has its own set of criteria. SOS is #3 in our list of criteria behind 1. being undefeated and 2. having at least one elite oos win. 

Not after getting blanked by SJB 28-0.

[Omaha Vol]

7 hours ago, GardenStateBaller said:

The N in MNC stands for National. Can't play an entirely in-state schedule and expect to be a "National" champ. Look at the last 5-7 years of Champs. They all have at least one oos win to their credit. Hence, the modern era of HSFB. 

Not always. I'm all for the OOS scheduling of teams. I just don't base my rankings entirely on that. N. Shore is a prime exammple of that. They've had some juggernauts over the years. 

[GardenStateBaller]

4 hours ago, Omaha Vol said:

Not always. I'm all for the OOS scheduling of teams. I just don't base my rankings entirely on that. N. Shore is a prime exammple of that. They've had some juggernauts over the years. 

The State of TX will never ever win another consensus MNC without an elite, OOS win on its schedule. 

[GardenStateBaller]

4-loss MC losing to Norland a second time this season undoubtedly hurts BGs overall resume. Also, the fact that every win BG has this season is over a public program is disgraceful. Power privates need to schedule and beat other power privates. 

[Sportsnut]

On 11/23/2023 at 10:43 AM, GardenStateBaller said:

Best win and SOS for current undefeated teams (per @misterfootball Top 50 Composite Rankings and CP): 

IMG- #11 SJP (45.5)

DS- #12 DV (43.0) *

C-M- #14 AHP (24.9) 

BG- #17 Cen10 (45.1) Beating up on public programs is NOT the formula for MNC success.

NS- #32 Summer Creek (38.5) *

@jeffthegaptoothedmod @christhebanker @kimpossible @billthepiedpiper @codbeardaddictwife @ECArejectson @andythehistorian 

* Not eligible for MNC due to no elite OOS wins. 

Why not only include privates in your poll?

You yourself just provided just cause 

[Sportsnut]

12 hours ago, GardenStateBaller said:

The State of TX will never ever win another consensus MNC without an elite, OOS win on its schedule. 

No such thing as " consensus MNC".

NO CONSENSUS.

[GardenStateBaller]

37 minutes ago, Sportsnut said:

Why not only include privates in your poll?

You yourself just provided just cause 

Why would I do that? Teams like MC and Cen10 regularly schedule power privates and beat them. That would be doing them a disservice. 

[acheaja8]

Hey there. I like the debate here.  The problem for Gorman is they shouldn’t be rewarded for backing out of MD for a game against LBP. Gorman backed out to play against a weaker team. Gorman knows the upside and the downside of playing MD.  It’s MD.  Poly didn’t even make make the CIF D1 bracket this year and lost to Servite in D2 playoffs. Gorman couldn’t know that earlier in the season but knows there is no debate if you play MD. Gorman is a program who plays for the MNC. They gambled when they shifted their schedule.  Nobody can be taken seriously if they hang their hat onGorman beating Cen10 by by more points than Bosco or MD. Or, even a coaches opinion on who was the “better” team between them. Gorman has the ability but not the motivations to ply MD or Bosco this year. That’s weak. And, Cen10 should be rightly rewarded for their record because of SOS.  The human pollsters should reflect rankings that are a bit tighter to the algorithms. An undefeated schedule and only one out of state game against a “power team” is not a strong enough criteria any longer when you consider, for example. the CIF D1 and D2 teams rankings this year. Maybe Florida or Georgia or Texas will benefit next year in the same way. But those few teams that can and should be considered every year for the MNC are separating from the pack as HS football is changing.   If you want to see more national matchups then the undefeated weighting has to mean less.  But, I’m the first guy to appreciate the diversity of approaches to the rankings from Massey to National HSFB.  Ultimately, Frank McManus called out Gorman last night and the Bosco win.  Will Gorman answer the challenge?

[CaliFB]

34 minutes ago, acheaja8 said:

Hey there. I like the debate here.  The problem for Gorman is they shouldn’t be rewarded for backing out of MD for a game against LBP. Gorman backed out to play against a weaker team. Gorman knows the upside and the downside of playing MD.  It’s MD.  Poly didn’t even make make the CIF D1 bracket this year and lost to Servite in D2 playoffs. Gorman couldn’t know that earlier in the season but knows there is no debate if you play MD. Gorman is a program who plays for the MNC. They gambled when they shifted their schedule.  Nobody can be taken seriously if they hang their hat onGorman beating Cen10 by by more points than Bosco or MD. Or, even a coaches opinion on who was the “better” team between them. Gorman has the ability but not the motivations to ply MD or Bosco this year. That’s weak. And, Cen10 should be rightly rewarded for their record because of SOS.  The human pollsters should reflect rankings that are a bit tighter to the algorithms. An undefeated schedule and only one out of state game against a “power team” is not a strong enough criteria any longer when you consider, for example. the CIF D1 and D2 teams rankings this year. Maybe Florida or Georgia or Texas will benefit next year in the same way. But those few teams that can and should be considered every year for the MNC are separating from the pack as HS football is changing.   If you want to see more national matchups then the undefeated weighting has to mean less.  But, I’m the first guy to appreciate the diversity of approaches to the rankings from Massey to National HSFB.  Ultimately, Frank McManus called out Gorman last night and the Bosco win.  Will Gorman answer the challenge?

All this is fine and dandy but if you understand how CIF works you know this has a 0% chance of happening. They'll see each other next season end of story. 

[GardenStateBaller]

19 hours ago, acheaja8 said:

Hey there. I like the debate here.  The problem for Gorman is they shouldn’t be rewarded for backing out of MD for a game against LBP. Gorman backed out to play against a weaker team. Gorman knows the upside and the downside of playing MD.  It’s MD.  Poly didn’t even make make the CIF D1 bracket this year and lost to Servite in D2 playoffs. Gorman couldn’t know that earlier in the season but knows there is no debate if you play MD. Gorman is a program who plays for the MNC. They gambled when they shifted their schedule.  Nobody can be taken seriously if they hang their hat onGorman beating Cen10 by by more points than Bosco or MD. Or, even a coaches opinion on who was the “better” team between them. Gorman has the ability but not the motivations to ply MD or Bosco this year. That’s weak. And, Cen10 should be rightly rewarded for their record because of SOS.  The human pollsters should reflect rankings that are a bit tighter to the algorithms. An undefeated schedule and only one out of state game against a “power team” is not a strong enough criteria any longer when you consider, for example. the CIF D1 and D2 teams rankings this year. Maybe Florida or Georgia or Texas will benefit next year in the same way. But those few teams that can and should be considered every year for the MNC are separating from the pack as HS football is changing.   If you want to see more national matchups then the undefeated weighting has to mean less.  But, I’m the first guy to appreciate the diversity of approaches to the rankings from Massey to National HSFB.  Ultimately, Frank McManus called out Gorman last night and the Bosco win.  Will Gorman answer the challenge?

Great post. We’re working with BG right now to get them to South Florida next season to play a top private. The fact that they played no privates this season is a farce. There’s no “backing-in” to a MNC. They’re earned. 

[GardenStateBaller]

SOS of most notable, undefeated teams as of this morning:

IMG 45.2

BG 44.3

DS 44.2

Walton 39.5

NS 37.5

C-M 27.7

[GardenStateBaller]

Love this. IMG should be the opponent, though. #nocowardsallowed